2 RMAs in 7 months

[Clouds84]

Case
FRACTAL FOCUS 2 ARGB GAMING CASE (BLACK)
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Processor (CPU)
Intel® Core™ i9 24-Core Processor i9-14900KF (Up to 6.0GHz) 36MB Cache
Motherboard
ASUS® PRIME Z790-P (LGA1700, DDR5, PCIe 5.0)
Memory (RAM)
32GB Corsair VENGEANCE DDR5 5600MHz (2 x 16GB)
Graphics Card
24GB AMD RADEON™ RX 7900 XTX - HDMI, DP - DX® 12

Partial changes were made on amendment [2966397] to: 24GB GIGABYTE RADEON™ RX 7900 XTX GAMING OC - 2 x HDMI, 2 x DP
1st M.2 SSD Drive
2TB SAMSUNG 980 PRO M.2, PCIe NVMe (up to 7000MB/R, 5000MB/W)
1st Storage Drive
NONE
DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
NOT REQUIRED
Power Supply
CORSAIR 850W RMx SERIES™ MODULAR 80 PLUS® GOLD, ULTRA QUIET
Power Cable
1 x 1.5 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead, 1.0mm Core)
Processor Cooling
PCS FrostFlow 240 Series ARGB High Performance Liquid Cooler
Thermal Paste
STANDARD THERMAL PASTE FOR SUFFICIENT COOLING
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Card
10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT
Wireless Network Card
WIRELESS INTEL® Wi-Fi 6E AX210 2,400Mbps/5GHz, 300Mbps/2.4GHz PCI-E CARD + BT 5.0
USB/Thunderbolt Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 2 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS
Operating System
Windows 11 Home 64 Bit - inc. Single Licence
Operating System Language
United Kingdom - English Language
Windows Recovery Media
Windows 10/11 Multi-Language Recovery Image - Unlimited Downloads from Online Account
Office Software
FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft 365® (Operating System Required)
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Norton 360 inc. Game Optimizer - Free 90 Day License
Browser
Microsoft® Edge
Warranty
3 Year Standard Warranty (1 Month Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour)
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Welcome Book
PCSpecialist Welcome Book

I purchased this system about 7 months ago and have had some issues. My first RMA was linked to my CPU which just outright failed. This happens I guess. My second RMA (yesterday) was linked to my graphics card. It seemed to have just died when loading into a game and after 10 minutes the screen went black and fans went full speed. The technical support couldnt fix the issue and windows had identified that there was a hardware issue with the GPU.

I'm just wondering if I'm just unlucky or does this happen a lot? I'm quite concerned now loading up any games as it appears a game killed my GPU. Two RMAs in 7 months seems a bit excessive..

 

[SpyderTracks]

Case
FRACTAL FOCUS 2 ARGB GAMING CASE (BLACK)
Promotional Item
Get a discount code for 20% off peripherals at Corsair.com

Promotional Code ZZ-PCS-B73C-49BX

Terms & Conditions
Promotional Item
Get Avatar: Frontiers of Pandora™ with select AMD products. (G)

Promotional Code FYWUWBS5GEFTJHVTLFPU
Processor (CPU)
Intel® Core™ i9 24-Core Processor i9-14900KF (Up to 6.0GHz) 36MB Cache
Motherboard
ASUS® PRIME Z790-P (LGA1700, DDR5, PCIe 5.0)
Memory (RAM)
32GB Corsair VENGEANCE DDR5 5600MHz (2 x 16GB)
Graphics Card
24GB AMD RADEON™ RX 7900 XTX - HDMI, DP - DX® 12

Partial changes were made on amendment [2966397] to: 24GB GIGABYTE RADEON™ RX 7900 XTX GAMING OC - 2 x HDMI, 2 x DP
1st M.2 SSD Drive
2TB SAMSUNG 980 PRO M.2, PCIe NVMe (up to 7000MB/R, 5000MB/W)
1st Storage Drive
NONE
DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
NOT REQUIRED
Power Supply
CORSAIR 850W RMx SERIES™ MODULAR 80 PLUS® GOLD, ULTRA QUIET
Power Cable
1 x 1.5 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead, 1.0mm Core)
Processor Cooling
PCS FrostFlow 240 Series ARGB High Performance Liquid Cooler
Thermal Paste
STANDARD THERMAL PASTE FOR SUFFICIENT COOLING
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Card
10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT
Wireless Network Card
WIRELESS INTEL® Wi-Fi 6E AX210 2,400Mbps/5GHz, 300Mbps/2.4GHz PCI-E CARD + BT 5.0
USB/Thunderbolt Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 2 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS
Operating System
Windows 11 Home 64 Bit - inc. Single Licence
Operating System Language
United Kingdom - English Language
Windows Recovery Media
Windows 10/11 Multi-Language Recovery Image - Unlimited Downloads from Online Account
Office Software
FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft 365® (Operating System Required)
Anti-Virus
Norton 360 inc. Game Optimizer - Free 90 Day License
Browser
Microsoft® Edge
Warranty
3 Year Standard Warranty (1 Month Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour)
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Welcome Book
PCSpecialist Welcome Book

I purchased this system about 7 months ago and have had some issues. My first RMA was linked to my CPU which just outright failed. This happens I guess. My second RMA (yesterday) was linked to my graphics card. It seemed to have just died when loading into a game and after 10 minutes the screen went black and fans went full speed. The technical support couldnt fix the issue and windows had identified that there was a hardware issue with the GPU.

I'm just wondering if I'm just unlucky or does this happen a lot? I'm quite concerned now loading up any games as it appears a game killed my GPU. Two RMAs in 7 months seems a bit excessive..

I'm willing to bet it's not a graphics issue, but again related to the CPU and PSU.

That platform is structurally flawed, and the CPU will deteriorate over time, once degredation has set in, there's nothing you can do but replace the processor. One of the symptoms is graphics issues, others are intermittent error messages with games exiting unexpectedly, apps failing to open, generally strange behaviour even on the desktop, memory overclock failures, there are a host of symptoms.

Intel 13th and 14th Gen confirmed defective

So there's been a lot of upset gathering steam on the inter webs with intermittent games crashes on Intel 13th and 14th gen. Workarounds range from underclocking to disabling ecores. BUT, there are a lot of people finding that simply disabling hyperthreading is a proper solution. The findings...

www.pcspecialist.co.uk

As we advised in your previous thread, the system is not designed to support the components, it's never going to work very well. The cooler isn't enough for the CPU which will lead to speedy degradation, the case isn't suitable to support the internals, the PSU isn't suitable for the components, with that processor, 850w is recommended as a minimum but that's assuming you're on an ATX 3 PSU which has 1.5x allowance for transient spikes. For an ATX 2 PSU which you have you'd need a minimum of 1000W, a symptom of transient spikes related issues would be black screens, BSOD's or simply power loss on the whole system.

There are numerous possible influences as to why that system will not run well in the long term. Instability and throttling is to be expected really so it's working as you would expect it to with these faults.

 

[Clouds84]

This was a pre-built system so there's not much I can do about this now. When I uninstalled the graphics drivers and ran on just the basics, I got display but as soon as I tried to install any drivers, the screen went black. I'm not sure how that could be a cpu issue?

 

[SpyderTracks]

This was a pre-built system so there's not much I can do about this now. When I uninstalled the graphics drivers and ran on just the basics, I got display but as soon as I tried to install any drivers, the screen went black. I'm not sure how that could be a cpu issue?

If you read the links it might make more sense.

That cooler is not enough for the CPU, nowhere near. It will be heavily thermal throttling under any load (like gaming), as such, due to the defects on that architecture, degredation will be happening at a far accelerated rate, even for that processor. You can conclusively prove this by running a cpu stress test like Prime95 to prove if cooling is sufficient. You can then do some basic tests to test any CPU degredation by running an Unreal 5 Simulation such as this: https://store.steampowered.com/app/770170/EzBench_Benchmark/

It may well be the graphics card has failed also, I believe you'd be able to conclusively prove that there wasn't adequate airflow due to the case by running a 100% stress load with the side panel on, and then with it off. Unless you've manually put in place optimisations, then I'm willing to bet the GPU will also be thermal throttling under load with the case closed and you'd see a big difference with the side panel off. Long term use under those conditions will also lead to eventual degredation which can result in failure. While that case is by no means a bad case, it's more for a mid range build, not for ultra high end as you have.

How it works with electronics is that PCB's which are the boards with all the circuitry on are linked together either with trace paths, or joins of solder. Both these are extremely susceptible to heat. That system due to it's design is an oven, no chance for it to get rid of the heat buildup from the CPU and GPU. That's aside from power delivery issues, motherboard not being suitable. The whole system just isn't well designed.

If that really is a pre-built, then personally I'd be making a complaint and asking for a refund

This is only my opinion and I don't speak for PCS in any way, but it’s based on some broad understanding. As I say, you can run some basic tests yourself to see if I’m correct or talking nonsense.

Im sure others will be able to share their thoughts as well

 

[SpyderTracks]

To do some basic maths

That GPU without an overclock has a total board power of 355w. As you overclock, power usage rises exponentially but let's take it as 355w

That CPU under load can spike up to around 300W IF it has the normal motherboard limitations in place. Asus was the worst though at applying automatic overclocking on their boards to allow unlimited power draw on the CPU. This means that again unless you've manually put in place limitations, that CPU could spike to around 335W

So on it's own just for the GPU and CPU you are talking potential max spikes of around 700w

Then you have to factor in transient spikes which means up to 2 x GPU TBP, so for you that equates to 710W potential spikes SOLELY for the GPU, that leaves you with only 140w headroom which is nowhere near enough to support the rest of the system. That's very worst case scenario but any time that happens, you would get symptoms that are very hard to track and reproduce, and also put a lot of stress on the PSU that it's not designed to deal with.

 

[Clouds84]

If you read the links it might make more sense.

That cooler is not enough for the CPU, nowhere near. It will be heavily thermal throttling under any load (like gaming), as such, due to the defects on that architecture, degredation will be happening at a far accelerated rate, even for that processor. You can conclusively prove this by running a cpu stress test like Prime95 to prove if cooling is sufficient. You can then do some basic tests to test any CPU degredation by running an Unreal 5 Simulation such as this: https://store.steampowered.com/app/770170/EzBench_Benchmark/

It may well be the graphics card has failed also, I believe you'd be able to conclusively prove that there wasn't adequate airflow due to the case by running a 100% stress load with the side panel on, and then with it off. Unless you've manually put in place optimisations, then I'm willing to bet the GPU will also be thermal throttling under load with the case closed and you'd see a big difference with the side panel off. Long term use under those conditions will also lead to eventual degredation which can result in failure. While that case is by no means a bad case, it's more for a mid range build, not for ultra high end as you have.

How it works with electronics is that PCB's which are the boards with all the circuitry on are linked together either with trace paths, or joins of solder. Both these are extremely susceptible to heat. That system due to it's design is an oven, no chance for it to get rid of the heat buildup from the CPU and GPU. That's aside from power delivery issues, motherboard not being suitable. The whole system just isn't well designed.

If that really is a pre-built, then personally I'd be making a complaint and asking for a refund

This is only my opinion and I don't speak for PCS in any way, but it’s based on some broad understanding. As I say, you can run some basic tests yourself to see if I’m correct or talking nonsense.

Im sure others will be able to share their thoughts as well

Thanks for your reply and explaining what the potential issue is. Unfortunately it is a pre-built system. I got it under the next-day PCs sections. Judging by your explanation of how the power works, I’m thinking of upgrading the PSU at the very least but that won’t fix the heating issue. I might just send it in for an ungrade after consulting with the PC specs section on the forums.

This is my second RMA and I think I’m going to continue to have problems unless I address these issues. I mean all I did was load a game up and after 10 minutes it broke the GPU (if it is the GPU that died). That doesn’t really feel me with confidence. From what I gather from your reply, I need a new PSU, cooling system and case.

 

[Clouds84]

I've had to uninstall the GPU drivers using DDU (in safe mode) so that the system is running on a basic display but as soon as I try doing a fresh install of GPU drivers (through the AMD website and not the software), windows tells me that there's an error due to a GPU hardware fault. I think I killed the GPU by overloading it with a graphic heavy game and there wasn't sufficient power and/or cooling and now it's defective.

I'm receiving a replacement GPU today. If this fixes my issue, would you recommend to not put the system under stress ie play games until I upgrade the system (PSU/cooling etc)? I'm not comfortable putting it under stress again and it ultimately breaking again without giving it the necessary resources it needs.

I have asked PCS technical support and they assure me that the system is fine and it will be ok to load games that will put my components under stress but I'm not convinced after reading your replies. It feels like PCS put this PC together on a budget and it doesn't feel fit for purpose.

 

[SpyderTracks]

I've had to uninstall the GPU drivers using DDU (in safe mode) so that the system is running on a basic display but as soon as I try doing a fresh install of GPU drivers (through the AMD website and not the software), windows tells me that there's an error due to a GPU hardware fault. I think I killed the GPU by overloading it with a graphic heavy game and there wasn't sufficient power and/or cooling and now it's defective.

I'm receiving a replacement GPU today. If this fixes my issue, would you recommend to not put the system under stress ie play games until I upgrade the system (PSU/cooling etc)? I'm not comfortable putting it under stress again and it ultimately breaking again without giving it the necessary resources it needs.

I have asked PCS technical support and they assure me that the system is fine and it will be ok to load games that will put my components under stress but I'm not convinced after reading your replies. It feels like PCS put this PC together on a budget and it doesn't feel fit for purpose.

If you read the links provided everything is explained, there's too much related to that system for me to address all over again.

 

[Clouds84]

If you read the links provided everything is explained, there's too much related to that system for me to address all over again.

I have read the article about intel CPUs and also the video on the PSU.

 

[SpyderTracks]

I have read the article about intel CPUs and also the video on the PSU.

So that tells you everything you need and how to test to prove each issue.