Advice on a mid range gaming spec please? Amd vs Intel

[mattdanielc]

Hi guys

Trying to find a new PC at the best spec I can get for gaming. I only play the following games - Rome:Total War, Empire:Total War, Starcraft 2 and Sims 3.

So whilst gaming is important to me I'm not after a massive gaming rig as you can see by my games. However I want it to load games better than my current (3 years old) spec. I also use my PC for general office work so want it to be able to handle multiple programmes etc.

My old spec:
Dell Dimenson (410/9200) DXP061 ACPIx86
Intel Core2 [email protected]
Nvidia 7900 GPU

My budget would ideally be around £600.

Got a few different ideas here...would like any advice

Is it worth paying for better power supply / case cooling? Or processor cooling? I've also not bothered changing the case yet as want to sort out the spec first. I AMD future proof compared to the i5?

Case
STYLISH PIANO BLACK ENIGMA CASE + 2 FRONT USB
Processor (CPU)
Intel® Core™i5-650 Dual Core (3.20GHz, 4MB Cache) + HD Graphics + Turbo Boost
Motherboard
ASUS® P7H55-M SI: MICRO ATX VALUE MAINBOARD,USB 2.0 & SATA 3.0Gb/s
Memory (RAM)
4GB SAMSUNG DDR3 DUAL-DDR3 1333MHz (2 X 2GB)
Graphics Card
1GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX460 GDDR5 PCI EXPRESS - DirectX® 11
Memory - 1st Hard Disk
640GB WD CAVIAR GREEN WD6400AARS, SATA 3 Gb/s, 64MB CACHE
1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM
Memory Card Reader
INTERNAL 52 IN 1 CARD READER (XD, MS, CF, SD, etc) + 1 x USB 2.0 PORT
Power Supply & Case Cooling
450W Quiet 80 PLUS Dual Rail PSU + 120mm Case Fan (£29)
Processor Cooling
INTEL SOCKET LGA1156 STANDARD CPU COOLER
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Facilities
ONBOARD 10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT
USB Options
6 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL (MIN 2 FRONT PORTS) AS STANDARD
Operating System
Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit - inc DVD & Licence (£79)

Price: £666.00 including VAT and delivery.

OR....

Case
STYLISH PIANO BLACK ENIGMA CASE + 2 FRONT USB
Processor (CPU)
AMD SEMPRON 145 (2.80GHz/1MB CACHE/AM3)
Motherboard
ASUS® M4A87TD/USB3: DUAL DDR3,SATA 6.0GB/s, USB 3.0
Memory (RAM)
4GB SAMSUNG DDR3 DUAL-DDR3 1333MHz (2 X 2GB)
Graphics Card
1GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX460 GDDR5 PCI EXPRESS - DirectX® 11
Memory - 1st Hard Disk
640GB WD CAVIAR GREEN WD6400AARS, SATA 3 Gb/s, 64MB CACHE
1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM
Memory Card Reader
INTERNAL 52 IN 1 CARD READER (XD, MS, CF, SD, etc) + 1 x USB 2.0 PORT
Power Supply & Case Cooling
450W Quiet 80 PLUS Dual Rail PSU + 120mm Case Fan (£29)
Processor Cooling
STANDARD AMD CPU COOLER
Sound Card
ONBOARD 8 CHANNEL (7.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Facilities
ONBOARD 10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT
USB Options
6 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL (MIN 2 FRONT PORTS) AS STANDARD
Operating System
Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit - inc DVD & Licence (£79)


Price: £561.00 including VAT and delivery.

OR....

Case
STYLISH PIANO BLACK ENIGMA CASE + 2 FRONT USB
Processor (CPU)
AMD PHENOM II X4 965 (3.40GHz/8MB CACHE/AM3) - BLACK EDITION
Motherboard
ASUS® M4A87TD/USB3: DUAL DDR3,SATA 6.0GB/s, USB 3.0
Memory (RAM)
4GB SAMSUNG DDR3 DUAL-DDR3 1333MHz (2 X 2GB)
Graphics Card
1GB ATI RADEON™ HD 5770 PCI EXPRESS - DirectX® 11
Memory - 1st Hard Disk
640GB WD CAVIAR GREEN WD6400AARS, SATA 3 Gb/s, 64MB CACHE
1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM
Memory Card Reader
INTERNAL 52 IN 1 CARD READER (XD, MS, CF, SD, etc) + 1 x USB 2.0 PORT
Power Supply & Case Cooling
450W Quiet 80 PLUS Dual Rail PSU + 120mm Case Fan (£29)
Processor Cooling
SUPER QUIET 22dBA TRIPLE COPPER HEATPIPE CPU COOLER (£19)
Sound Card
ONBOARD 8 CHANNEL (7.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Facilities
ONBOARD 10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT
USB Options
6 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL (MIN 2 FRONT PORTS) AS STANDARD
Operating System
Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit - inc DVD & Licence (£79)

Price: £623.00 including VAT and delivery.

-----------
Thanks for any help

 

[Phoenix]

This build will outperform all of the other builds you posted, comes with a cooler case and is closer isn't too far from your budget:

Case
COOLERMASTER ELITE 310 BLUE CASE
Processor (CPU)
AMD PHENOM II X4 955 (3.20GHz/8MB CACHE/AM3) - BLACK EDITION
Motherboard
ASUS® M4A78LT-M: mATX MAINBOARD, DDR3, USB 2.0, SATA 3.0Gb/s
Memory (RAM)
4GB SAMSUNG DDR3 DUAL-DDR3 1333MHz (2 X 2GB)
Graphics Card
1GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX460 GDDR5 PCI EXPRESS - DirectX® 11
Memory - 1st Hard Disk
640GB WD CAVIAR GREEN WD6400AARS, SATA 3 Gb/s, 64MB CACHE
1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM
Power Supply & Case Cooling
450W Quiet 80 PLUS Dual Rail PSU + 120mm Case Fan (£29)
Processor Cooling
STANDARD AMD CPU COOLER
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Facilities
ONBOARD 10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT
USB Options
4 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL (MIN 2 FRONT PORTS) AS STANDARD
Operating System
Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit - inc DVD & Licence (£79)
Office Software
FREE Microsoft® Office Starter 2010 (Limited functionality Word & Excel)
Anti-Virus
BULLGUARD INTERNET SECURITY - FREE 90 DAY TRIAL
Warranty
3 Year Silver Warranty (1 Year Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour) (£5)
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Build Time
Standard Build - Approximately 9 to 13 working days
Quantity
1

Price: £613.00 including VAT and delivery.

(http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/computers/amd-home-office-pc/)

 

[mattdanielc]

hi mate. thanks for the help

2 questions...

1) the build you've gone for has the AMD PHENOM II X4 955 whereas I went for the 965 (which is faster right?). But you say it will still outperform my build?

2) Are Nvidia cards ok in an AMD machine? Sorry for sounding a bit daft - but I thought ATI cards went in an AMD...

Thanks again

 

[Phoenix]

Yes the 965 is faster but for games having a GTX460 instead of a HD5770 will make a lot more difference than having a slightly better CPU. If you have the money to upgrade to the 965 then it's not a bad idea it just moves further away from your budget. And yes, Nvidia cards are fine in an AMD computer

 

[mattdanielc]

Cheers for the help again mate. I saw other people mention the Nvidia card you chose - so it's to know I can afford it. I don't mind stretching over 600 slightly if it makes a big difference. What sort of difference would it make it if I chose the X4 970 instead of the 955? According to this site it is quicker - but will I notice a difference in anything on a practical level?

Finally...(for now ) are AMD definitely ok compared to intel? I've always had Intel and all the news is about the I5 / I7 really?

Cheers

 

[Phoenix]

Hmm well the 970 is better but I don't think you'd notice the difference too much, the 955 is a solid quad core CPU that will run any game and it's closer to your budget so I'd be inclined to stick with it. Yes AMD are good, the i5 range is just as good for gaming and the i7 range is generally better especially when using 2 or more graphics cards but there's quite a difference in price and you don't really need an i7.

 

[mattdanielc]

Thanks again. Will stick with AMD then as they are cheaper. Looking on pcspecialist there are 2 different motherboards to choose from. The one you quote above is from 'Home/Office computers' (M4A78LT-M) wheras if you click on 'Top spec computers' you get the M4A87TD/USB3.

I've clicked on the descriptions for motherboards and I can see the last one offers me more PCI slots...but is there any advantage for me paying extra to get the 'top spec' motherboard?

Thanks if anyone can help

 

[Gorman]

Not unless the top spec board carries specific features which you need or may need in the future.

 

[mattdanielc]

Not unless the top spec board carries specific features which you need or may need in the future.

Well the 87TD model has SATA 6.0GB (and USB 3.0) whereas the 78 only has SATA 3.0GB. The 87TD also has 'dual-ddr3' whereas the 78 is just ddr3.

What does SATA do? And do you think it's worth getting the dual DDR3 option? Not sure what either means and google doesn't really explain it either

 

[Gorman]

SATA is the data connection to various drives such as your hard drive or optical drives. Unless you are going for an SSD drive you dont need to worry about 3gbs Vs 6 gbs as 3 will do fine.

Similarly with RAM and DDR3 descriptions, its not something you are going to be using or should consider unless going for a top end machine.

 

[mattdanielc]

Fantastic thanks. Need to measure up the dimensions when I get home as sadly all the cases except the bog standard one appear to be too big (depth) but apart from that I'm good to go.

Thanks for all the help guys

 

[mattdanielc]

Hi Phoenix...hope you're still around.

Just tried to create your spec (post #2 for anybody else) and it's £5 more than yours?

It also says:

We notice that you have selected a 450W power supply, but based on our calculations we recommend you change your selection to a 600W power supply because your computer could require up to 455W of power including a 20% allowance.

Do you think I need to pay extra for the power supply?

Case
COOLERMASTER ELITE 310 BLUE CASE
Processor (CPU)
AMD PHENOM II X4 955 (3.20GHz/8MB CACHE/AM3) - BLACK EDITION
Motherboard
ASUS® M4A78LT-M: mATX MAINBOARD, DDR3, USB 2.0, SATA 3.0Gb/s
Memory (RAM)
4GB SAMSUNG DDR3 DUAL-DDR3 1333MHz (2 X 2GB)
Graphics Card
1GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX460 GDDR5 PCI EXPRESS - DirectX® 11
Memory - 1st Hard Disk
640GB WD CAVIAR GREEN WD6400AARS, SATA 3 Gb/s, 64MB CACHE
1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM
Memory Card Reader
INTERNAL 52 IN 1 CARD READER (XD, MS, CF, SD, etc) + 1 x USB 2.0 PORT
Power Supply & Case Cooling
450W Quiet 80 PLUS Dual Rail PSU + 120mm Case Fan (£29)
Processor Cooling
STANDARD AMD CPU COOLER
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Facilities
ONBOARD 10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT
USB Options
4 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL (MIN 2 FRONT PORTS) AS STANDARD
Operating System
Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit - inc DVD & Licence (£79)
Office Software
FREE Microsoft® Office Starter 2010 (Limited functionality Word & Excel)
Anti-Virus
BULLGUARD INTERNET SECURITY - FREE 90 DAY TRIAL
Warranty
3 Year Standard Warranty (1 Month Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour)
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Build Time
Standard Build - Approximately 9 to 13 working days
Quantity
1

Price: £617.00 including VAT and delivery.

 

[Rakk]

Just tried to create your spec (post #2 for anybody else) and it's £5 more than yours?

Prices do change, they depend on many different things.

It also says:

We notice that you have selected a 450W power supply, but based on our calculations we recommend you change your selection to a 600W power supply because your computer could require up to 455W of power including a 20% allowance.

Do you think I need to pay extra for the power supply?

Well I would, given that power supplies do degrade over time and you might decide to add extra thinsg to your machine over time, and you don't really want to risk it not having enough power to run your machine - as well as that power supplies can be a bit of pain to upgrade later on

So yeah, I'd upgrade the power supply.

Also don't forget the silver warranty for a fiver, it'd be silly not to.

 

[Sleinous]

Yep, they change by small increments every so often. Especially when stock market changes a bit.

 

[Phoenix]

I didn't include a card reader with the build I posted which is where the £5.00 went (didn't think you'd be too bothered about one). And about the power supply, it says in the information panel that the GTX460 only needs a 450w PSU and I didn't get an error when I made it earlier but a 600w one wouldn't hurt.

 

[mattdanielc]

Hi guys

Thanks for all the help.

Going to get the InWIN DRAGON SLAYER BLACK GAMING CASE instead of the cheaper COOLERMASTER ELIE 310 BLUE CASE as it is slightly smaller (depth) so will fit better where I want it to go. So I've decided to stretch to £700 instead of 600... so any ideas on whether to upgrade more RAM (4-8?), better processor cooling or a better processor (the 970 instead of the 955)?

Would appreciate any views

 

[Gorman]

for me it would be the higher clocked cpu. Cooling shouldnt be a bif issue with AMD

 

[mattdanielc]

for me it would be the higher clocked cpu. Cooling shouldnt be a big issue with AMD

If I was to focus on a better CPU...

£685 will get me the X4 955
£702 will get me the X4 965
£717 will get me the X4 970

£715 will get me the X6 1055
£726 will get me the X6 1075

The X6 1090 is too expensive.

I can afford the X6 1075 - so think I might go for it - it should be quite a bit better than the X4 955? Again would appreciate any views.

 

[Tom DWC]

Check out this thread, it discusses the same topic.

 

[Gorman]

If this rig is for gaming you would be better off with the higher clock speed 4 core. Games rarely use more than 2 cores so i would take higher clocks over 2 low clock cores with 4 redundant cores.