Laptop not allowing me to access the Nvidia Display/resolution settings only 3d settings

[SpyderTracks]

Sorry OP I am derailing this thread. MSHybrid and Optimus are exactly the same thing, the MUX is the switch which is used to switch between MSHybrid/Optimus and the dGPU.

No, this isn't correct.

Optimus was the first iteration of GPU switching, this was just a software firmware layer, but you still output through the iGPU to reach the dGPU

MSHybrid came later but is essentially the same

Then recently came MUX. Mux actually reroutes the graphics output directly to the nvidia card by switching the actual circuitry it's passing through. This requires dedicate hardware and is very new. It completely bypasses the iGPU and disables it.

On a previous generation, this is why you could never disable the iGPU even if you'd enabled dedicated graphics, if you did the screen just wouldn't work, because even if you're running off the dGPU, it's going via the iGPU firstly. So iGPU was always enabled.

What is a MUX Switch for Gaming Laptops? - Jarrod's Tech

A MUX switch lets you disable the integrated graphics in your gaming laptop, giving you a performance increase in games at the expense of worse battery life. To understand what a MUX switch does, you need to first understand how Optimus works. October 2023 update: MUX switch matters less with...

jarrods.tech

 

[Aza]

I am sure I had a mux switch in my 2012 Vortex and my 2020 defiance and they were both clevo.

I had a vortex (III?), but I think it was a full fat GPU, not a mobile version (if that makes a difference?)
To be honest it was that long ago I dont even remember what options I had in the control panel anyway.... just wondered if maybe it was relevent

 

[barlew]

No, this isn't correct.

Optimus was the first iteration of GPU switching, this was just a software layer, but you still output through the iGPU to reach the dGPU

MSHybrid came later but is essentially the same

"This is Optimus at work, also known as MSHybrid." From Jarrod.

Then recently came MUX. Mux actually reroutes the graphics output directly from the nvidia card by switching the actual circuitry it's passing through. This requires dedicate hardware and is very new.

On a previous generation, this is why you could never disable the iGPU, if you did the screen just wouldn't work, because even if you're running off the dGPU, it's going via the iGPU firstly. So iGPU was always enabled.

What is a MUX Switch for Gaming Laptops? - Jarrod's Tech

A MUX switch lets you disable the integrated graphics in your gaming laptop, giving you a performance increase in games at the expense of worse battery life. To understand what a MUX switch does, you need to first understand how Optimus works. October 2023 update: MUX switch matters less with...

jarrods.tech

We are agreeing with each other here but perhaps I have not worded my previous post particularly well. The MUX switches between the iGPU (which utilises MSHybrid/Optimus) and the dGPU physically, the MUX does not replace MSHybrid. This is not new, this is how switchable discrete graphics have always worked. It would not be possible to have switchable discrete laptop graphics without a MUX.

"A MUX (short for Multiplexer, often misspelled as “mucks” or “muc”) switch lets us manually enable or disable the integrated graphics. It does this by physically changing the connection between the GPU and the screen. Being able to disable Optimus therefore requires that the laptop has physical hardware support for this feature" From Jarrod.

Here is a photograph from my Valeon which also uses a MUX to switch between MSHybrid and the dGPU like my old Vortex:

The other scenario are gaming laptops which utilise Optimus/MSHybrid but do not have the ability to have discrete graphics. These laptops do not have a MUX switch and for power efficiency the laptop passes the dGPU output to the iGPU which then sends it on to the screen. As there is no MUX present there is no way to switch to dGPU.

*Edit for clarity*

 

[petdox]

Wow what a great discussion and a lot of information to take in. I asked this question on here as a bit of a punt, but the knowledge you people have is amazing. I don't think anyone meant to come across as salty, I'm just grateful for the input. My level of understanding has greatly improved because of it and I am still googling some of the stuff (🥴) you discussed. Thank you all 😁

 

[barlew]

Because the wife is out with the kids and I have nothing better to do with my day this has mega peaked my interest, and I have been doing some reading. I have found this Nvidia driver installation guide from 2012, where it discusses installing Linux Nvidia drivers on Optimus laptops with and without MUX switches.

Chapter 18. Using the NVIDIA Driver with Optimus Laptops

As I said before this technology is not new. We only started talking about it recently because manufacturers started removing it from their systems and the ability for discrete graphics was no longer available.

Here is another interesting bit of history from 2010 where CNET introduces the new Optimus technology. It appears that the MUX switch was included in laptops before Optimus was even a thing: https://www.cnet.com/culture/nvidia-optimus-unveiled-switchable-laptop-graphics-on-the-fly/

and another article from the register: https://www.theregister.com/Print/2010/02/09/inside_nvidia_optimus/

So it looks like we went from using a MUX switch to switch between the iGPU to dGPU, to Optimus switching between the iGPU and dGPU albeit, by routing the dGPU through the iGPU, as previously discussed. We then moved on to integrating a MUX with MSHybrid so that laptops could have the efficiency of the dGPU routed through the iGPU or they could be switched through the MUX to allow for discrete graphics.

*Edit* here is another article from 2012 discussing how to configure Red Hat linux on Optimus laptops with MUX switches https://access.redhat.com/articles/2877991

 

[barlew]

Wow what a great discussion and a lot of information to take in. I asked this question on here as a bit of a punt, but the knowledge you people have is amazing. I don't think anyone meant to come across as salty, I'm just grateful for the input. My level of understanding has greatly improved because of it and I am still googling some of the stuff (🥴) you discussed. Thank you all 😁

Out of interest have you booted into BIOS to checked whether you can switch between Discrete and MSHybrid graphics modes?

No-one is salty here its just good old fashioned debate and discussion.

 

[petdox]

Out of interest have you booted into BIOS to checked whether you can switch between Discrete and MSHybrid graphics modes?

No-one is salty here its just good old fashioned debate and discussion.

Looked in BIOS but advanced only shows a limited amount of options;

SATA mode
Power on boot beep
Battery low alarm beep

Have they locked other options? Looks pretty basic to me 🤷‍♂️
Thanks

 

[barlew]

Looked in BIOS but advanced only shows a limited amount of options;

SATA mode
Power on boot beep
Battery low alarm beep

Have they locked other options? Looks pretty basic to me 🤷‍♂️
Thanks

No mate if you did have the ability to switch to dGPU it would be there. Unfortunately you just have Optimus on its own.

 

[petdox]

😕😪, thanks anyway

 

[Hercules Smith]

I consider myself to be fairly computer literate but I do think it is highly confusing/worrying when you spring for a laptop with a pricey gaming card and then all the available interface things tell you that it's not connected to the screen and so it appears it's not ever doing anything. It's a bit much to expect people to think "Oh, it's telling me it's not connected but I'm sure it is". It's crazy I tell ya!!!!

Nvidia/Microsoft could make this way more clear as to what is happening.

What's the best I can tell 100% that my expensive graphics card is being used when it's needed?

I do have a second screen that I plug in to the firewire for normal office type dual screen work, so I suppose my main big screen on my laptop is being done by the GPU in the i7 and the smaller, more crappy screen is benefiting from £100s worth a graphics card? If I leave that screen plugged in and launch a game then is the pc going to carry on using the graphics card to show my emails on the crappy screen and use the GPU for the game, or will they swap round, or will the graphics card try and do both? How can I tell what's happening?

I get that it's all about saving power, certainly when using the battery, but I find all this very unintuitive and needlessly confusing.

Thanks

 

[SpyderTracks]

I consider myself to be fairly computer literate but I do think it is highly confusing/worrying when you spring for a laptop with a pricey gaming card and then all the available interface things tell you that it's not connected to the screen and so it appears it's not ever doing anything. It's a bit much to expect people to think "Oh, it's telling me it's not connected but I'm sure it is". It's crazy I tell ya!!!!

Nvidia/Microsoft could make this way more clear as to what is happening.

What's the best I can tell 100% that my expensive graphics card is being used when it's needed?

I do have a second screen that I plug in to the firewire for normal office type dual screen work, so I suppose my main big screen on my laptop is being done by the GPU in the i7 and the smaller, more crappy screen is benefiting from £100s worth a graphics card? If I leave that screen plugged in and launch a game then is the pc going to carry on using the graphics card to show my emails on the crappy screen and use the GPU for the game, or will they swap round, or will the graphics card try and do both? How can I tell what's happening?

I get that it's all about saving power, certainly when using the battery, but I find all this very unintuitive and needlessly confusing.

Thanks

That's why it's important to ask for advice when buying something like a PC or a car or house, you wouldn't assume yourself an expert, those with common sense would ask elsewhere for experienced advice.

 

[Martinr36]

How can I tell what's happening?

Open task manager, and the performance tab, you'll see inn there which GPU is taking the strain and to what degree

 

[Hercules Smith]

That's why it's important to ask for advice when buying something like a PC or a car or house, you wouldn't assume yourself an expert, those with common sense would ask elsewhere for experienced advice.

Hmmm, what advice do you think I would have known to ask for?? Something like "If I buy this laptop with a nice graphics card will the interface make it look the the graphics card isn't doing anything?" Why would I ask for advice on an issue I would totally have no way of predicting?

 

[SpyderTracks]

Hmmm, what advice do you think I would have known to ask for?? Something like "If I buy this laptop with a nice graphics card will the interface make it look the the graphics card isn't doing anything?" Why would I ask for advice on an issue I would totally have no way of predicting?

Because you'd know you weren't an expert. Do you know all the tests they do on an MOT? Do you know all the verifications they do a survey on a house?

No, you just know that it's best to ask for help.

 

[Hercules Smith]

Open task manager, and the performance tab, you'll see inn there which GPU is taking the strain and to what degree

Ahh, right. I'll give that a try. Thanks.