Not seeing all power options available - options are hidden in the registry, needs to be manually reenabled.

[Sonic1506]

I've been touring the internet looking for a solution to restore advanced power options and I keep seeing this same reference, it might be worth a try. It simply requires changing a DWORD value of the key CsEnabled from 1 to 0.

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Power



I'm not certain this solution will work but it apparently has for many I read about. FYI, CsEnabled on my PC is set to 1 and I have all the options available.

I've seen this online but a bit wary about following it. I also don't have CsEnabled in my Registry so I'd have to create that.

 

[SpyderTracks]

Yes, ordered with Windows. I had an issue with the OS randomly giving me problems so I sent the whole device back to PCS who reinstalled Windows via the BIOS. After I got it back with a few days testing, I noticed the above things missing, phoned up support and they were unable to get them back and put it down to a Windows issue.

TBH, at this stage I would just do a clean install, only takes about 30 mins and far quicker than troubleshooting. Plus then you know it's configured correctly.

That would then rule out software, if the issue is still present, then it's something else.

 

[Sonic1506]

TBH, at this stage I would just do a clean install, only takes about 30 mins and far quicker than troubleshooting. Plus then you know it's configured correctly.

That would then rule out software, if the issue is still present, then it's something else.

Just following this up and to update the thread:

The BSOD issue is solved, Christopher from PCS Support fixed this remotely by doing driver updates another way that I wasn't aware of. Essentially deleted all my current drivers and downloaded fresh new ones using another Nvidia and AMD utility. I've tested using the same conditions as when it failed and *touch wood* all has been well.

To confirm, the missing advanced power options are normal according to PCS Support. They say these are locked out as part of the hardware and not to worry about it. Edit - This advice is incorrect after further research. It seems to be disabled in the registry, re-enabled some things in the registry and I have control of what was missing. I did a clean Windows 10 install via USB and I had to then enable some registry entries to get some of the missing advanced power options back. It's all already in there in Windows, just disabled to view

Thank you again for your help.

 

[Sonic1506]

Just to update this. I played Cyberpunk 2077 the other day and while in a menu the CPU temps were at 95 degrees, even with a cooler, I know Cyberpunk isn't fully optimised and is a fairly intensive game. Although PCS say this is in operating temperature, I wasn't fully happy and I researched more about how to bring temps down. I had a few questions and I raised this with PCS. I re-installed Windows 10 on SSD1 in my device to see if that automatically brought back in my missing options - it didn't. The options are there in the registry but are not enabled for view. You would have to modify the registry to enable it. You can then modify it in the Advanced Power Options as you see fit.

I got a tech who investigated more as well as me doing my own investigation and we found this: https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us...nagement/f5e30954-1843-464e-838b-015cc21d3ebd. Seems Windows/Microsoft DOES hide these options which isn't ideal for users like us who want to manage this ourselves.

While Step 1 didn't do anything for us.
Step 2 did, as well as PCS tech support enabling a few other things in the registry. Step 2 DID bring back Processor Power Management, so I should be able to drop down my maximum processor to 99% or even lower to 90% to see if that brings to temps down, doing some research online seems to point that turning this down 1%-10% makes huge differences supposedly on HP Omen laptops while still keeping the performance at the level one would expect, so hopefully works the same on the PCS Machines. I'll be doing some testing and passing on the findings here as well as to PCS Support.

 

[SpyderTracks]

Just to update this. I played Cyberpunk 2077 the other day and while in a menu the CPU temps were at 95 degrees, even with a cooler, I know Cyberpunk isn't fully optimised and is a fairly intensive game. Although PCS say this is in operating temperature, I wasn't fully happy and I researched more about how to bring temps down. I had a few questions and I raised this with PCS. I re-installed Windows 10 on SSD1 in my device to see if that automatically brought back in my missing options.

I got a tech who investigated more as well as me doing my own investigation and we found this: https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us...nagement/f5e30954-1843-464e-838b-015cc21d3ebd. Seems Windows/Microsoft DOES hide these options which isn't ideal for users like us who want to manage this ourselves.

While Step 1 didn't do anything for us.
Step 2 did, as well as PCS tech support enabling a few other things in the registry. Step 2 DID bring back Processor Power Management, so I should be able to drop down my maximum processor to 99% or even lower to 90% to see if that brings to temps down, doing some research online seems to point that turning this down 1%-10% makes huge differences supposedly on HP Omen laptops while still keeping the performance at the level one would expect, so hopefully works the same on the PCS Machines. I'll be doing some testing and passing on the findings here as well as to PCS Support.

Nerfing the CPU is not a way to manage temps, if you're doing that you're not addressing the problem.

CPU temps should always be made sure to be optimal with a repaste so you know it's a good paste job, and then an underviolt to optimise further.

If you're nerfing performance, why bother buying a good processor, just wasting money

 

[Sonic1506]

Nerfing the CPU is not a way to manage temps, if you're doing that you're not addressing the problem.

CPU temps should always be made sure to be optimal with a repaste so you know it's a good paste job, and then an underviolt to optimise further.

If you're nerfing performance, why bother buying a good processor, just wasting money

Appreciate the response.

Only going off what I've read from people with a gaming laptop on various forums. Seems to be the norm to turn down the CPU by 1%-10% and there is no loss of performance.

PCS said it's unlikely that the laptop needs a repaste as it's only a month old and there's no point opening it up as it's highly unlikely the paste is the issue. However I will raise this as an issue if the above doesn't work and see what they say. I've got the upgraded paste in mine.

I was advised not to undervolt and I don't know how to do this either but happy to learn if you have any reading material, recommendations or recommended software?

 

[SpyderTracks]

Only going off what I've read from people with a gaming laptop on various forums. Seems to be the norm to turn down the CPU by 1%-10% and there is no loss of performance.

There is a loss of performance, 10% if you're scaling back 10% CPU.

It's the norm from people who don't know how to manage temps.

Unfortunately PCS have a weak area in pasting, we often find repastes out of the factory tend to improve performance.

I was advised not to undervolt and I don't know how to do this either but happy to learn if you have any reading material, recommendations or recommended software?

There's loads of guides on the internet.

 

[Sonic1506]

There is a loss of performance, 10% if you're scaling back 10% CPU.

It's the norm from people who don't know how to manage temps.

Unfortunately PCS have a weak area in pasting, we often find repastes out of the factory tend to improve performance.


There's loads of guides on the internet.

Fair point, I can only go on what I've read and what I've been read from other forums. PCS have told me that under normal conditions and when playing Assetto Corsa the temperatures are within what they expect. It's only with CP2077 they said it's a bit high but it's expected because of CP2077, again what I've been told.

Re: Guides, I'll look but if you have anything you can send, much appreciated. I've found this: https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/how-to-undervolt-cpu-guide/ But AMD Ryzen Master isn't supported for my CPU on my laptop. AMD have confirmed this as well as the AMD forums and PCS. ThrottleStop says my CPU isn't supported either. Is there any other software that can be used? Struggling to find anything that works with AMD Ryzen 5900HX and most sources say the AMD Ryzen 5900HX can't be undervolted.

I have these in Control Centre but no idea what this does. Struggling to find info:

 

[SpyderTracks]

Fair point, I can only go on what I've read and what I've been read from other forums. PCS have told me that under normal conditions and when playing Assetto Corsa the temperatures are within what they expect. It's only with CP2077 they said it's a bit high but it's expected because of CP2077, again what I've been told.

Re: Guides, I'll look but if you have anything you can send, much appreciated. I've found this: https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/how-to-undervolt-cpu-guide/ But AMD Ryzen Master isn't supported for my CPU on my laptop. AMD have confirmed this as well as the AMD forums and PCS. ThrottleStop says my CPU isn't supported either. Is there any other software that can be used? Struggling to find anything that works with AMD Ryzen 5900HX and most sources say the AMD Ryzen 5900HX can't be undervolted.

I have these in Control Centre but no idea what this does. Struggling to find info:

Oh, apologies, I didn't realise it was AMD.

It definitely shouldn't be that high if it's an AMD processor, I would suggest a repaste. AMD's run about 10 degrees cooler than intel.

 

[Sonic1506]

Oh, apologies, I didn't realise it was AMD.

It definitely shouldn't be that high if it's an AMD processor, I would suggest a repaste. AMD's run about 10 degrees cooler than intel.

I personally don't think it needs a repaste but I've ordered some Arctic MX-4 and will do it anyway, I didn't see any benefit with Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut from research. I've found a utility for AMD Ryzen that I'm testing at the moment. Initial tests seem to be positive so far and similar to undervolting the CPU slightly.

 

[SpyderTracks]

I personally don't think it needs a repaste but I've ordered some Arctic MX-4 and will do it anyway, I didn't see any benefit with Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut from research. I've found a utility for AMD Ryzen that I'm testing at the moment. Initial tests seem to be positive so far and similar to undervolting the CPU slightly.

I wouldn't use artic MX-4 personally, it's very old now. Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut is far better.

But it should be around mid 80's under full load.

 

[Sonic1506]

I wouldn't use artic MX-4 personally, it's very old now. Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut is far better.

But it should be around mid 80's under full load.

Bit of a long post here with what I've spent my evening doing, watching tons of YouTube videos, reading tons of articlestrawling tons of Reddit and AMD Forum posts and hopefully it will help others.

In doing my research into this issue, I found that it's not just PCS laptops that would suffer with the issue of running unreasonably hot. There's lots and lots of people on Reddit with the same issue with AMD Ryzen chips in various laptops, HP & ASUS are examples which is why I doubt it's anything to do with pasting, but I'll eliminate this. A lot of the commentators on Reddit say they're getting 85-90 degrees under load. A few sources linked to an open source program called Ryzen Controller, it's got various settings and using that seems to keep the temperatures in check, there would be some loss of performance, that's a given but I didn't notice any with Assetto Corsa. Ryzen Controller also made a significant difference to Cyberpunk, from 95 degrees down to the 80 degree region, peaking at 86 or 88 if memory serves me right in my quick test and benchmark, I need to test more on the FPS side to see what the loss is here.

AMD themselves say the Ryzen chips can work up to 105 degrees, obviously not ideal or what anyone would want. I also found out that AMD Ryzen chips have Turbo Boost on by default and for my chip, 5900HX, sources state it can clock over 4GHz, I ran a test and saw mine was going up to 4.4GHz. I found how to enable this in the Registry Editor so that I can turn this on and off as I see fit but of course, some performance lost, in the case of Assetto, I lost 5 FPS if memory serves me right, something I could live with, but temps are brought right down.

I've tried also reducing Maximum Processor state to 99% and again, made a huge difference as far as temperatures are concerned for negligible performance lost in my tests. Nothing was lost with Assetto Corsa, Cyberpunk needs more testing, temperatures are in the 70 region in my quick test and benchmark.

Seems the issue is that AMD Ryzen Master which you would use to undervolt the CPU isn't compatible with their mobile version of chips, lots of Redditors have said this, AMD have said this and it's even on AMD's forums, seems to only be compatible with the desktop chips. I hope AMD bring out an update for Ryzen Master to allow it to work with mobile CPU's, but because it doesn't, this is why workarounds have to be done for AMD users, sucks but what can you do. If I was aware of this before, I probably would have gone down the Intel route, reason I didn't is because I've had issues with Intel devices before so I tend to stay away from them or a bit wary I should say, "once bitten, twice shy and all that".

I couldn't find any sources that stated Grizzly was better than MX-4, seemed under tests they were the same, one just costs more than the other and supposedly one lasts "longer" than another with Grizzly rated for 2/3 years and MX-4 rated for 8 years but recommendation is repaste every year from what you've said previous. Lots of discussions on Reddit about it but consenus seems the same, I can always try out Grizzly after.

 

[Sonic1506]

Best Thermal Paste for CPUs 2024: Over 50 Compounds Tested and Ranked

The right thermal paste will improve performance.

www.tomshardware.com

Thanks for this.

Not really compelling arguments as to why one paste is better than another from my first glance, admittedly I skim read it so probably missed the charts and control tests and only comparing Arctic and Grizzly and according to the "rating system" there, Arctic and Thermal Grizzly are the same rating both with 4.5 and 4.0 for their respective ease of use and performance.

I'll take a proper look in the morning.

 

[SpyderTracks]

Thanks for this.

Not really compelling arguments as to why one paste is better than another from my first glance, admittedly I skim read it so probably missed the charts and control tests and only comparing Arctic and Grizzly and according to the "rating system" there, Arctic and Thermal Grizzly are the same rating both with 4.5 and 4.0 for their respective ease of use and performance.

I'll take a proper look in the morning.

Again, you don't want to disable turbo boost, that's important single core performance that you're sacrificing totally needlessly, at the moment you're following bad advice on Reddit which is known to be very misguided.

I won't offer any more advice after this, you need to choose the source of info that you're going to trust. Google will tell you whatever you're searching for, if you don't have underlying understanding of the basic principles behind it, google is not going to help you.

It's really hard to try to explain. Laptops are not like desktops in relation to cooling.

The cooling is dependent on the chassis. There are good chassis and bad chassis with regards to cooling. Just because one chassis runs at 85 and one at 95 doesn't mean that you should settle with 95 if you're chassis doesn't normally run at that. Comparing the temps of your chassis with other branded chassis is a really strange thing to do as there's no correlation as the cooling will be totally different. Also bear in mind, repasting a branded laptop will often invalidate your warranty so it's not an option for most, which is why they resort to ridiculous workarounds rather than treating the root cause.

Your chassis is a known quantity as lots of people on this forum have had them.

95c is far too high on that chassis with the 5900hx.

A repaste would be the first port of call.

I would agree, mx4 and thermal grizzly are pretty much neck and neck, I must have been thinking the old mx3

And it's not windows hiding those settings, it's down to the chassis manufacturer as to what they enable in their drivers.

I'll bow out now, there's nothing more I can add.

But don't nerf the performance of the chip, I don't know why people even think that's a viable solution in the first instance. The whole reason you choose something like the 5900hx is for it's good boost clocks and high all core clocks. Disabling those is like putting a limiter on a Ferrari to stop it going so fast, for those hearing that who have any understanding of engines, it's completely insane, and obviously incorrect.

 

[Sonic1506]

Again, you don't want to disable turbo boost, that's important single core performance that you're sacrificing totally needlessly, at the moment you're following bad advice on Reddit which is known to be very misguided.

I won't offer any more advice after this, you need to choose the source of info that you're going to trust. Google will tell you whatever you're searching for, if you don't have underlying understanding of the basic principles behind it, google is not going to help you.

It's really hard to try to explain. Laptops are not like desktops in relation to cooling.

The cooling is dependent on the chassis. There are good chassis and bad chassis with regards to cooling. Just because one chassis runs at 85 and one at 95 doesn't mean that you should settle with 95 if you're chassis doesn't normally run at that. Comparing the temps of your chassis with other branded chassis is a really strange thing to do as there's no correlation as the cooling will be totally different. Also bear in mind, repasting a branded laptop will often invalidate your warranty so it's not an option for most, which is why they resort to ridiculous workarounds rather than treating the root cause.

Your chassis is a known quantity as lots of people on this forum have had them.

95c is far too high on that chassis with the 5900hx.

A repaste would be the first port of call.

I would agree, mx4 and thermal grizzly are pretty much neck and neck, I must have been thinking the old mx3

And it's not windows hiding those settings, it's down to the chassis manufacturer as to what they enable in their drivers.

I'll bow out now, there's nothing more I can add.

But don't nerf the performance of the chip, I don't know why people even think that's a viable solution in the first instance. The whole reason you choose something like the 5900hx is for it's good boost clocks and high all core clocks. Disabling those is like putting a limiter on a Ferrari to stop it going so fast, for those hearing that who have any understanding of engines, it's completely insane, and obviously incorrect.

1. AMD don't let you undervolt, This is from AMD themselves, hence having to use other software as I've said before. Ryzen Master does NOT work with their mobile chipset, not sure why, that's an AMD thing and it's an unknown if it will be supported. This is NOT an issue with Intel as there are Intel tools that allow undervolting.
2. It's known that AMD chips run hot and are rated up to 105 degrees. This is from AMD themselves as I've said before.
3. It's a known issue on multiple different chassis. HP Gaming Laptops, ASUS Gaming Laptops as examples as I've said before.
4. I know desktops are not like laptops, laptops generally run hotter due to their nature of having everything tightly packed together as well as having less efficient cooling, hence I'm not overly concerned to the point where it's a blind panic, especially going on what I've read on official forums and official sources, I just see it as not ideal for me personally when I want to balance performance and longevity, in the sense that I don't want the laptop to outright die after 2 years. I haven't compared my temperatures to others to say that mine is completely out. See point 6 for further info.
5. It was hidden in the Windows Registry, so I'm sorry but I don't buy your "it's down to the chassis manufacturer". I did a full clean Windows 10 reinstall via bootable USB and the missing advanced power options did NOT appear until I re-enabled them in the registry, again other people on other forums have reported the same. Microsoft has many tech topics about this and have said it's something to do with Windows Updates and hiding these from the end user. On Microsoft forums and tech answers, HP Gaming Laptops and ASUS Gaming Laptops users also have the same issue and the Microsoft answer is to re-enable it in the Registry.
6. I don't think a repaste will make a difference but as I said to eliminate this, I'll be doing it next week. I will report back after extensive testing under different scenarios but I don't think this is the issue but I'm sure if the temperatures are still "high", you'll either say it's still a bad paste job still OR it's just the chassis. If it is the chassis, then what else can be done? Nothing, other than working out how to increase cooling/thermal efficiency which will entail a significant redesign of the cooling system - you've said yourself that some chassis handle heat better than others. As far as temperatures are concerned there are multiple variables so I can't compare mine to others, not sure why you think I'm doing this when I haven't even said or hinted that I've been doing this. I've compared my temperatures under load against what AMD say. As far as when I raised temperatures in my previous post, I'm comparing my own temperatures to my own tests, both without limits, with limits, with cooling pad, without cooling pad, with Ryzen Controller, without Ryzen Controller, while keeping an eye on performance losses with a performance overlay on top.
7. Thermal Grizzly for 4g for argument sake is £12.99. Arctic MX-4 for the same quantity £4.77 - not that I would need that much, but for argument sake. I couldn't find any proof that Thermal Grizzly was better than Arctic MX-4. Some sources said that Arctic was better as it would last longer before needing to be re-applied, as I said before. Yes, I know other manufacturers don't have an open case policy, PCS does, however, it would be down to the end user to decide what they want to do. Invalidate their manufacturer warranty to test to see if this makes a difference or use another limit.
8. As I said AMD themselves have been used as a source as have other manufacturers. Where have I said that Reddit is gospel and should be taken as 100% truth? I haven't. I pointed it out at as there's tons of different threads about similar issues and multiple sources are better than none.
9. 95 on Cyberpunk 2077 is okay according to PCS, I've spoken to different techs there on different support levels that say the same thing. They've also said the chips can run up to 105. To be clear, this isn't being taken as gospel. This goes back to point 6. I'm not sure if you're aware, but Cyberpunk 2077 has had a hellish development and the game is not optimized in any fashion so using this as a benchmark isn't the best but it is a game that is intense on CPU/GPU and a game that I enjoyed on XBox One X (original release), Series X (Next Gen Release), hence A) Wanting to play it again on PC with the added benefit of mods and B) finding this issue. As I said, Assetto Corsa and Assetto Corsa Competizione, maxxed graphics with 24 cars on track and Custom Shaders is hitting 120+ FPS and the temperatures are in the low-mid 80 range which the PCS tech I spoke to was surprised with, when I spoke to him about it with as he expected it to be in the high 80s.
10. Where have I said I will run forever limit the CPU? I haven't, I did it as a test and as proved in my tests so far, no performance has been lost. I'm sure your aware of tests and how different circumstances need to be taken into account before coming up with a solution?
11. Taking your Ferrari analogy into account, you''re not going to bounce the limiter in every single gear, very chance you get as you'll destroy the engine. It's completely insane and obviously incorrect use. Some times the end user needs to take a proactive or reactive action due to an issue with the manufacturer, case in point, S55 engines and the crank hub where with increased power over factory maps they have more of a tendency to spin and can cause the timing to go out and worst case scenario, destroy the engine. This can also happen with factory untuned engines as well be it the standard map, competition map or the CS map. You either upgrade the crank hub/fit capture plate or you take preventative measures not to force a violent kickdown through the car when booting it, i.e. user controlled limits.

If you know how to Undervolt and AMD Ryzen mobile CPU, as I said before, please provide some guides or reading as so far, it is NOT possible leading to workarounds with limits OR using Ryzen Controller - further testing is needed with Ryzen Controller - It's NOT official software. As you've said in a previous post, repaste or undervolt (and then saying it's the chassis), but if the undervolt can't be done because AMD have said so, then what do you suggest? Live with it running hot and decrease longevity or impose a small limit to increase longevity? I know what I'd be doing in my personal situation. Questions asked, I assume, are rhetorical going by your last reply.

FWIW, I have a background in IT and Engineering so I do have an understanding but there's nothing wrong with asking for second opinions. Thank you.

 

[Aza]

Let us know how the repaste goes.

 

[Sonic1506]

Let us know how the repaste goes.

Will do. Will test over a week before reporting back.

 

[Jasontvnd]

Nerfing the CPU is not a way to manage temps, if you're doing that you're not addressing the problem.

CPU temps should always be made sure to be optimal with a repaste so you know it's a good paste job, and then an underviolt to optimise further.

If you're nerfing performance, why bother buying a good processor, just wasting money

If his CPU is 10th gen or later and not a K series laptop CPU under volting is locked out.

Alot of the newer gen Intel CPUs will boost upto thermal throttling level regardless of the paste job just due to the fact it's hard to cool a 115w CPU.

His only real options are to limit his power state like he's doing or not care about the temps which is honestly what I do , I had a 10750h laptop before this that is 3 years old now still running strong despite bumping off the CPU throttle limit on a daily basis.

I have no doubt it will limit it's lifespan but honestly I suspect by the time it is kaput it will probably be long obsolete.

The fact Intel lock out undervolting is ridiculous in my opinion , Just another ploy to get you to go for a 12900HK instead of a 12700H which are basically the same processor but costs £300-£400 more for nothing really.

To the OP depending on the laptop it will usually have software that will limit the CPU to 45w or let it run rampant at whatever it feels like boosting to.

The limits of my defiance 17 before a repaste where around 75w and now with Kryonaut around 90w.

It just doesn't have a big enough Heatsink with enough air volume to cool what is essentially now desktop levels of TDP.

So a repaste will help but it won't stop it reaching high temps most likely.

 

[Sonic1506]

If his CPU is 10th gen or later and not a K series laptop CPU under volting is locked out.

Alot of the newer gen Intel CPUs will boost upto thermal throttling level regardless of the paste job just due to the fact it's hard to cool a 115w CPU.

His only real options are to limit his power state like he's doing or not care about the temps which is honestly what I do , I had a 10750h laptop before this that is 3 years old now still running strong despite bumping off the CPU throttle limit on a daily basis.

I have no doubt it will limit it's lifespan but honestly I suspect by the time it is kaput it will probably be long obsolete.

The fact Intel lock out undervolting is ridiculous in my opinion , Just another ploy to get you to go for a 12900HK instead of a 12700H which are basically the same processor but costs £300-£400 more for nothing really.

To the OP depending on the laptop it will usually have software that will limit the CPU to 45w or let it run rampant at whatever it feels like boosting to.

The limits of my defiance 17 before a repaste where around 75w and now with Kryonaut around 90w.

It just doesn't have a big enough Heatsink with enough air volume to cool what is essentially now desktop levels of TDP.

So a repaste will help but it won't stop it reaching high temps most likely.

I have an AMD Ryzen 9 5900HX. I've been speaking to the team behind Ryzen Controller and they've developed a different bit of software AMD APU Tuning Utility that I'm trying out. It allows me to tweak TDP and the CPU wattage.

Repaste, largely made no difference to temps and PCS initial paste job had nothing wrong with it, but to be honest, I've just been enjoying the laptop and playing modded AC/ACC and CP2077, everything I'm reading and being told (By AMD as well as PCS and other sources) is that the temps I'm getting and hitting at full tilt is normal and nothing to be concerned with.

AMD say they also don't allow undervolting on their mobile chips.